11 October 2009

Fiona Payne: 'Kate McCann kept putting her hands on the twins to check if they were breathing'

Page two of Fiona Payne Statement given to DC 1485 MESSIAH of the Leicestershire Police Major Crime Team in 10 April 2008
00.53.22 1485 “Did the twins wake up at all?”

Reply “They didn’t. They didn’t”.

1485 “In the aftermath?”

Reply “No, and that was the other thing, she kept going into the twins, she kept putting her hands on the twins to check they were breathing, she was very much concerned in checking that they were okay. But they were okay, I mean, they were fine, they didn’t, they were asleep, but at the time it did seem weird, I remember thinking, you know, when the Police came they turned the lights on, there was loads of noise, obviously from the moment Kate discovered that Madeleine was gone, the screaming and the shouting and there was a lot of noise and they, they didn’t, you know, so much as blink”.

Fiona Payne's Statements here:



34 comments:

  1. If only this stuff could find it's way into the stinking, despicable British newspapers for the brainwashed masses to read.

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  2. But they said they had the twins tested, proving they had not had them drugged, didnt they?

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  3. remember this, 'harm' is a consequntial requirement of an omission - neglect.

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  4. They are allowing this talk of all three kids being drugged by abductor so that if body turns up with traces of drugs in hair samples, they wont get the blame. For goodness sake the stupid woman (Kate) used to be an aneathatist, (sorry cant spell it) she also would have known how to drug her kids so she could go on the piss with her obnoxious husband and equally neglectful moron mates. Is it time for the body to be found, or should i say mysteriously turn up?
    Jan

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  5. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1570315/Madeleine-McCanns-mother-takes-drug-test.html

    Reports in UK papers on twins' tests appear on October 20 2007
    Lots of reports on google

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  6. The body must be found and a suspect implicated who then conveniently dies taking his secret with him to the grave. There is no other way for the parents to end the suspicions of their involvement and move forward with their new careers on the international speaking circuit.
    His: Media Privacy and Reputation Protection Expert
    Hers: Ambassador for Child Protection and Abduction Prevention.
    IMO IRONSIDE is right; terminally ill Hewlett, having used chloroform once before, is still very much in the frame, but it will be a move fraught with danger. What if the body was buried wrapped in a pink blanket?

    T4two

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  7. did Fiona Payne tell that ONE YEAR LATER?
    Probably she had stated this in Portimão in 2007 and she had no other choice but to confirm what she had said on her first statement.

    But the Mccanns are still friends with the Paynes.
    Even after the Mallorca case has been known.

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  8. With the assistance of bent politians and double glazing salemen they have silenced and bought witnesses.
    This pair of sad individuals have managed thus far to evade justice.

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  9. In the Telegraph article, which by the way is from November 2007, it says:

    "The mother of missing Madeleine McCann has undergone a drugs test to prove she was not on medication at the time of her daughter's disappearance, it has been revealed."
    ...
    "But the results of toxicology tests on a strand of Mrs McCann's hair showed no evidence that she had taken drugs in the past eight months, her legal team announced."

    ...


    "The McCanns' two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, have also been tested to prove they were never given sedatives, after claims that Madeleine may have died of an accidental overdose."

    ...

    "The drug tests, which were conducted in September, form part of a dossier of evidence compiled by the McCanns' legal team to demolish the police case against them."

    Now, if I understood correctly these "tests" were done in September, not in May 2007, when they should have been done and when they would have any significance and validity.
    By September I believe it would be too late, too much could have taken place, like the twins haircuts and Kate having her hair coloured (highlights). I have no idea for how long any traces of drugs remain in human hair oe if hair dye afects the possibility of accurate testing, but for me it is a case of too little too late. The testing should have been done in May, in Portugal and by the forensic lab of the PJ, not months later in England, privatelly, in an unknown lab, with no real evidence of the tests results, other than the "legal team" say-so.
    Funny how they claimed that their behavoir towards the checking on the children was considered "within the boundaries of responsible parenting" by the "appropiate agencies", but we're never told which agencies were that, nor did they produce any actual proof of it, like a report, etc., and once again the same goes for the drug tests, no lab results were made public, the lab was not named and we are expected to believe it because they said so!

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  10. Joana, I was wondering if you or Astro knows how libel laws function in Portugal? Will the burden of proof of libel be with the McCann or will it be like in England in which case the burden of proof lies with Mr. Amaral?
    These latest articles are puzzling. There was the low copy number article and now this chloroform and horse tranquilizer article. The chloroform idea probably came from the Caley Anthony case. I don't understand the reason for this silliness. Anyone with an average I.Q. who has followed this case would immediately be aware of contradictions to past declarations and the unlikelihood of said events.
    I understand the Portuguese tourism industry advertises in England each year. They have even used personalities such as Jose Mourinho to promote tourism in the Algarve. Aren't these people who spend money promoting the Algarve concerned about these ridiculous articles that continuingly portray the Algarve as a dangerous place for children? Shouldn't they take legal action?

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  11. Madeleine's body will never turn up. These are professionals - they know how to dispose of a corpse.

    Didnt one of their number juggle corpses as part of their part time job?

    Someone mentioned the speaking circuit, spot on! Gerald is building his career.

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  12. It seems almost as if the McCanns own detectives are actually trying to expose them. I guess its my wishful thinking!

    I guess Edgar and co are jsut stupid.

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  13. Re the comment above "wrapped in a pink blanket" - I would also add "inside a blue sports bag".

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  14. "Madeleine's body will never turn up. These are professionals - they know how to dispose of a corpse."

    If you believe that the parents of a little girl could actually bring themselves to 'dispose' of their daughter's corpse as if it were a bag of rubbish then I'd have to agree with you.
    But I do think that he is more calculating than that scenario would give him credit for.
    IMO to dispose of the corpse would have been a huge error of judgement - no corpse = no closure, ever. No closure = continuing suspicion and no international careers of any merit.
    Of course his arrogance could have got the better of his judgement in which case he has condemned himself and his wife to a never ending fight to prove their innocence. Perhaps he just didn't envisage that a growing number of intrepid internet posters would continue to question his official version of events more than two years later. If indeed there was a cover-up of some kind involving influential politicians and others then the longer this goes on the more embarassment caused, which doesn't actually bode well for the future of the main protagonists either.

    T4two

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  15. IMHO - I believe the clue to solving this case is where they go/have been on each of the anniversary of Maddies death/disappearance

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  16. No I don't think there is a Uk government cover-up. If there was, then Eddie and Keela wouldn't have been allowed within 50 km of Praia da Luz.
    I think it is simply a case that the authorities still don't have enough evidence to prove who it was who removed Maddy's body on the night. It may have been one person, a couple or a small group of people involved. But maybe this and the motive for it will become clearer if the libel action goes to trial.

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  17. I have to agree with T4two, they are playing a dangerous game, look what happened to Dr Kelly. I am sure the people in high places who assisted in this cover up will not be happy with the McScams ongoing nonsense. There is bound to come a time when the McScams die in a nasty 'accident'.
    Jan

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  18. "...he has condemned himself and his wife to a never ending fight to prove their innocence.
    Perhaps he just didn't envisage that a growing number of intrepid internet posters would continue to question his official version of events more than two years later."

    T4Two, I believe that to be the case.

    That and of course the fact that Amaral, having been removed from the case, didn't keep fearfully quiet about the investigation as they expected.

    A losing battle of course because the more Web sites they try to close the more will appear;
    the more lawsuits they start the more publicity the case gets;
    I wouldn't be surprised if somebody else took on distributing leaflets.
    From the beginning, I never even understood why it would be necessary for innocent parents to try and prove their innocence in the media.

    Unless the case is solved, the more they try to divert attention and hush suspicion the more people will suspect them.

    That, and what I believe is the memory of a dead child, is not a prospect I envy.




    Off-topic but this is exactly how I believe that Cuddlecat gained the cadaver smell: :-(

    "Killer mum sent to secure hospital
    ...
    Police found Chloe had been dressed and laid out on the bed with a soft toy by her side"

    http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/liverpool-news/uk-world-news/2009/10/09/killer-mum-sent-to-secure-hospital-92534-24892577/

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  19. The more I read recent articles published in the British Press about look-alike Madeline in Sweeden, abductor not only drugging the children but having a key to gain entry to the apartment, cleaning up the crime scene the more I am convinced that they are taking the p..s out of the McCanns , I would imagine that any good reporter would have read all the conflicting accounts given by the McCanns, their friends and family. Someone once said there is no such thing as bad press, because even if it is negative its still good because bad press is better than no press. The British Newspapers must be very wary of what they now print given the fact that any negative comments towards the McCann Team could cost them dearly, so maybe writing utter nonsense alerts the readers to ask more questions. There is also another saying "there is more than one way to skin a cat"

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  20. The Express's "They Were All Drugged" claim is what always leads me back to the conclusion that Maddie died much earlier in the evening than the PJ state.

    For the McCann's to have drugged the twins means that they must have had to concoct the whole evening charade and they didn't want the twins waking up or have them asking awkward questions (2 year olds can say alot - my daughter was rabbiting away at 18 months)

    Gerry admitted that the twins were drugged in the Panorama interview and now their P.I.'s are corroborating that fact.

    The McCann's refused to have the twins taken to hospital to be checked over... and only agreed to have them checked for sedatives 3 months later when no trace would have been found.

    They are incriminating themselves with every interview....

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  21. Joana, I would like very much to know if that story on Maria magazine, about Mr. and Mrs. Amaral, is true.
    Particularly about what Amaral is saying, there.
    After our very bad experience with Duarte Levy, cheating everybody on a pathological way, I wonder if Amaral really said those words Maria publicised.
    It would be wonderful, if it would be true but I am not yet certain about that.
    Is there a way to check on this, is Sofia Amaral prepared to answer this question, please?

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  22. The longer the hair the more forensics will find information of drug use.Madeleine had long hair,this could have been tested for drugs and would have shown how long she had been given sedatives. (Remember the Mathews case) maddies grandmother stated on live TV."Madeleine had a sleep problem, Kate used to sedate Madeleine thats how we knew she would not have wandered off.".This was removed and never shown again.Kates mother knows exactly what happened to her grand daughter.
    Goncalo would have had this case sewn up by the end of September 2007 had he been allowed to continue his investigation.

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  23. Not forgetting Fiona's mum's rogatory interview. DW = Dianne Webster

    4078: ”What did you see when you got there?”

    DW: ”What did I see? Well Kate and Gerry, Gerry was absolutely, absolutely distraught, absolute, you know, I mean I’ve never heard a man make the noises he made, err and Kate, Kate was just err you can’t, you just can’t put into words how they were I mean they were just, I remember I went through into the room where err where Madeleine was sleeping and err and she said you know, somebody, you know, she’s been taken because she said that the shutters and that had been open, the window open. Err the twins were still asleep in the cot and I, with all the noise going on I don’t know how they slept through it which makes me think there was, they must have been err drugged with something.”

    .........

    4078: “And you said you wondered if they’d perhaps been drugged.”

    DW: “Mm.”

    4078: “I think it’s one of the questions that the MCCANN’S want us to ask anyway, but have you ever seen their children being given any medication?”

    DW: “Oh no, no.”

    4078: “So how would you imagine that they may have been drugged?”

    DW: “Err by the abductor. I think Madeleine would have been drugged as well.”

    4078: “Yeah, and the night when they were sleeping, did anybody try to wake them? Other than it being noisy and they were moved.”

    DW: “No, no I mean err when they, when they were brought up to our apartment err they had a sort of blanket over them and they were asleep on err I think it was David and Fiona that carried them up and they were just sleeping on their shoulder and obviously didn’t want to wake them up because the cots were being brought up and they were put, put, but you know my, my feeling is that they, I think a child normally would haven woken up under the circumstances.”

    4078: “How were they when they woke up the following morning?”

    DW: “Oh fine, yeah.”

    4078: “No different to normal?”

    DW: “Yeah, lively twins.”

    ................

    DW: “Err I mean I, my feeling is the person that err Jane saw err that it was Madeleine that he was err carrying. I also have a feeling that, that because of the, the time between Gerry having checked on, on the children and her being taken, err and I think I mentioned it to Gerry, you know, at the time, well not at the time but days later, that the abductor may well have already been in the apartment when he went to check on Madeleine.”

    4078: “That could have made sense couldn’t it when you look at the time, time scale of things.”

    DW: “Yeah, I mean because it happened so, there’s such a short err time and I also think that the children would have been sleeping soundly when Gerry saw them because maybe by that time they had been err drugged with, I don’t know, I mean I wouldn’t know whether there’s anything, chloroform had been put over them.”

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  24. Not only did Kate used to work as an anaesthetist, Gerry worked in either Holland or New Zealand testing sportsmen for drugs.

    Between the two of them they must have a great amount of knowledge of what kind of drugs to use on people and also how long the effects and traces of drugs will last before disappearing from a persons body.

    Eve

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  25. Short ago I went to Moskou for a week.
    From my gids there, I heard that that small airplane coming from Helsinki, years ago, did not land on the Red Square but on a viaduct or bridge behind the square.I saw the place.
    Checking on youtube today, about a small boy who fell down on a gorilla's place at a zoo, I observed that the gorilla sat down near him for a short time, to protect the boy from other gorillas and it not carried him to a gate and delivered him to a man, like I had read on the papers, at that time.
    Watching Rudolf Nureyev's interviews on youtube, he personaly tells that, when he defected at the French airport, he just walked to two police man, saying "I want to stay in your country" and he denied the story of a row between the French police and the KGB.According to him, the KGB runned away and left the airport.According to a witness, there as a fight.

    What do I want to say here?
    That I really don't know what to believe or not.

    I would love to believe the article Maria magazine wrote and believe what Amaral seems to have said.

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  26. On McCannfiles' I watched the video about the disappearence of the 2 years old little girl in Zealand.
    The parents were on it and the father spoke to the public.
    The mother looks bad, destroyed, and she is very shy, I think, not feeling comfortable in front of the cameras.
    I hope the little girl will be found very soon.
    Very sad, very sad.

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  27. When you read the rogatory interview in full one is at a loss really...

    A five or ten minute search? When the poor girl could have wandered off for all they knew?? You'd give up after that short lapse of time?

    She refuses to do the reconstruction. And yet...in due course, the McCanns are more than happy to co-operate in a (bogus) TV reconstruction.

    And isn't it sick, sick, sick that not a single journalist in our allegedly free media is challenging them on even ONE of these points of blindlingly obvious contradiction, prevarication,evasion etc. ...

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  28. And the Mccann's did not gave permission to the police to test the twins or to ask them some questions on the days after the event. I remember that some criminologists in the TV said that the PJ was ready to ask the help of a team of American Psichologists which are used to help the FBI asking questions to litle childs. They even gave the example of a litle girl in America ( with less then 2 years old) which was the only one which survive an attack where her parents have been killed. The girl was able to remember the attack and gave information to the police which help them catch the perpetrator of the crime. BUT THE MCCANN'S REFUSED THAT IDEA STRAIGHT AWAY WITH EXCUSE THAT THE TWINS WILL BE STRESSED WITH ALL SITUATION AND INSTEAD THEY ASKED THE HELP OF A BRITISH PSICHOLOGIST TO HELP THE TWINS DEAL WITH LOSS OF THEIR SISTER.
    The portuguese people, which at the time are in big effort searching for Madeleine, did not understand and accept that decision. HOW CAN PARENTS OF A MISSING CHILD REFUSE SUCH PROPOSAL FROM THE POLICE?.... EVEN IF THE SITUATION CAUSED A BIG STRESS TO THE TWINS, IT WAS ON BEHALF OF THEIR SISTER... TO HELP THE POLICE QUICLY TRACE OVER WHAT HAPEN TO HER AND BRING HER SAFE AND SOUND.

    GOOD WORK JOANA, THAT YOUR EFFORT was HIGHLIGHTING SOME SITUATIONS WHICH HAPPENED BEHIND SCENES, and CAN EXPLAIN HOW THE MCCANN"S NEVER SEARCH AND HELP THE POLICE SEARCHING FOR THEIR DAUGHTER. In all investigation they act as a blocked force, "FORCA DE BLOQUEIO", to divert the police from every single step which can lead to a quickly and successful end of the story.

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  29. If an abductor woke the children whilst doing a dry run, why didn't he just grab Maddie and make a dash for it. It wouldn't be difficult to restrain a 3yr old.
    Instead he risks coming back the following night, knowing full well the children may have warned their parents about an intruder the night before? Also, he still risks waking them and starting their crying again before he can administer the drugs/chloroform, unless of course he had three pairs of hands and was able to restrain all three at once while drugging them.
    After the crying episode the night before, it is more likely the parents drugged them to keep them asleep while they enjoyed their evening.
    Who knows? it could even of been that the twins were drugged to ensure they didn't witness what the parents were doing with Maddie's body in preparation for disposing of it.?

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  30. Lets go to Brasil after Nz,Sweden and the like.....

    Article in spanish from Mercedes blog.Original in portuguese here

    "Casal brasileiro faz campanha pela menina Madeleine"

    http://www.tvcanal13.com.br/noticias/casal-brasileiro-faz-campanha-pela-menina-madeleine-78117.asp

    It is the ususal crap but apparently the mccies who have an awful of infos about Madeleiene"s whereabouts CANNOT speak about the "investigation".......

    And the circus goes on and on and on....the most famous never ending story ever

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  31. Isto é uma barraca! Os McCann e os Associados dão a entender que a PJ devia ter feito análises aos gémeos. Chamam-lhes incompetentes na entrelinhas. É bem feito para a PJ que em vez de ter a coragem de apontar logo os pais como possíveis suspeitos, obrigá-los logo à reconstituição, (tantos indícios no dossier da PJ, tantos...) preferiu usar "pinças" porque eram ingleses, ricos e muito bem relacionados. Isto prova: que em Portugal os directores das instituições que nos deviam proteger são subservientes e que cá há crimes de primeira e crimes de segunda, aliás como em Africa. Com arguidos pobres e ranhosos a PJ já pode usar outros critérios. Acabará como a Casa Pia: as crianças indemnizam os pedófilos. Aqui, os investigadores ingleses amadores e de segunda que se riem dos nossos Magistrados e da PJ, ainda vão a tempo de elaborar uma tese que permita questionar a possibilidade de ter sido a própria PJ (ao não ter investigado indícios fortes e evidentes) responsável pela morte da criança no apartamento 5-A e posterior ocultação de cadáver. As próximas notícias apontarão no sentido da investigação ter falhado pelo facto dos canídeos não terem ido às instalações da PJ perdendo-se para sempre a possibilidade de identificar qual o inspector com medidas small que vestiu a roupa de Kate para a incriminar (o grande malandro). Irra como é que o PGR lida bem com isto pá!?
    Alexandra

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  32. Has anyone got a link to the Maria magazine article please?

    Eve

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  33. As cadaverine is only released 2 hours after death, Madeleine must have died much earlier in the day. Therefore it makes sense that the twins were given drugs to make them sleep while they cleaned up and disposed of Madeleine's body; hence Kate's concern that she may have overdone it when faced with the dilemma of making sure they didn't wake up while they were 'cleaning up' coupled with the possibility of giving them too much. That's why she kept checking. Incidentally, I think it would have been a very different scenario if Amelie had been 'taken' rather than Madeleine. No smiling, relieved faces from the McCanns if that had happened....

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  34. The body will appear... You just have to wait.

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